Things We Fancy

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We use HTML to apply meaningful mark-up to content – making things lists seems like a good ides. Some of the answers here scare me… seems there is a weird believe that SASS can do anything. "Authors SHOULD provide a dialog label. But I’m not sure if that’s important to that audience. One of the first things you’re taught about coding is how to structure a navigation and this is normally done with an unordered list. We can target tags in CSS, but if we target classes, the tags can change (such as when updating to HTML 5). I second the idea of a navigation item. Does your theory still apply? Far as styling goes I’ve created a nice little utility _tools.scss file that I can easily work in a mixin that removes some of the browser styles when using normalize if I absolutely have too. Ein Teiler, der Inhaltsbereiche oder Gruppen von Menüelementen voneinander trennt und unterscheidet. The related posts above were algorithmically generated and displayed here without any load on my server at all, thanks to Jetpack. Lee, he’s right. There have been a couple of surveys by WebAim – this is the latest (sadly, back in 2009): Answer: it’s because DIV and SPAN do not carry any semantic meaning in and of themselves and without extra data applied, be it in the form of classes or ID’s, roles or whatever. All the above being said, I’ve also read a few of the screen reader comments and they make sense. :) A quick straw poll of around 30 screen reader users this afternoon suggests that many find lists useful in this context. I prefer using a list as it gives me lots of extra elements for free (which are handles for styling – think rollovers and icons added), renders nicely even in non-CSS environments (like an RSS reader showing a table of contents pointing to anchors in the document) and it adds space between links which makes it easier on touch devices without having to style anything. ARIA role="presentation" is completely ignored if it's used on focusable element. A more interesting discussion is whether or not the navigation is an ordered list or not. In my testing, VoiceOver tabs through the navigation in the exact same way, whether it’s in a list or not. Die Bedeutung von role=form ist nicht erforderlich, da Sie keine kontrastierende Rolle auf ein bereits semantisches Element anwenden sollten, da durch das Hinzufügen einer Rolle die native Semantik eines Elements überschrieben wird. If there is no hierarchy in your navigation then ul works perfect but in cases where it might require importance or sequence, ol could make a nice argument. Very interesting – and very… sad! These days usually nothing, no div, span, paragraph, definition or anything, since labels should be above the fields, I find most layouts achievable without any additional markup. The minute we decide not to use lists, we start wondering whether we should use divs, span, paras, sections or whatever else instead. And here’s an interesting tidbit from that same page: Screen readers allow users to extract the links into an alphabetically-organized list, using a keyboard shortcut within their screen reader software for that purpose. Sometimes, the most subtle thing could make a huge different in the quality of browsing a particular site. The compelling reasons to use ol or ul are usually: This is the way it has been tested and implemented on the majority of the web. In the last week or so it has landed in the nightly builds of Firefox, WebKit and Chrome. Having something cohesive, nimble, and made by the same experts that use them is better than the slow-to-implement, inconsistent group of screen readers and browsers currently available. :) Some things need changing, others really only need changing when they are broken, rather than breaking them for the sake of applying a new hot technology or saving code. And goes on to show an example of a navigational paragraph. Last I checked, 2 < 1. We need to collectively wrap our minds around this until we fully grasp the nascent truth just sitting here. – buy After all, it’s still a list of pages. To you, maybe, but not your user. Chuck, I’m still struggling, I’ve just tested a few HTML-only skip-nav links, and can’t find any issue. There has to be a way of roping off content like this programmatically to ensure accessibility. If you think about them as normal content inside a tag, would it be the kind of content that you would put inside a ul? I don’t think that was clear. This happens automatically for most elements when you use a strong semantic HTML structure, but you can also add or remove objects programmatically with accessibility hooks like: role="presentati… That’s not a problem unique to lists. If you write clearly, use HTML elements for their intended purpose, present your information clearly, and remember that people have different levels of abilities, your work will be accessible to many more people. Sorry, I think you misunderstood me or I did not express myself well, but I think WAI-ARIA, modern HTML5 and the existence of screen readers is absolutely awesome! The idea of list-based markup giving “extra” elements for free is a nonunique benefit. I’m saying we shouldn’t think that NAV being here now somehow means a list of links is no longer a list. This is a list, too, because it’s a series of similar items!” And I have to stop (and punish) myself from (for) the ol > li > article flotsom and jetsam that would invariable ensue.

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